I hate to ask this, but does your magenta cartridge actually have any ink in it? Is this a new cartridge, or the one which originally came with the printer? Sounds like you've done all of the right diagnostic stuff...

If it turns out you need a fresh cartridge, check out these folks:
http://www.4inkjets.com/

The cartridge is brand new, and weighs at 40g. I've tried 2 different new cartridges... I'm at a loss, I'm just going to keep working on the magenta head inside the printer, i have discovered under a magnifying glass the small filter holes are "caked" over, so im trying to figure out how to unclog them. Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Jason

Jason,

I'm not so sure I would have applied steam. You could try using a cotton swab dipped in an alcohol solution to clean the nozzle orifices from the outside.

The steam machine was set relatively low, I don't think the steam will pose a problem, and i've tried using "nozzle rocket" on the head with a q tip, and still nothing... keep the suggestions coming!

Jason

I've never heard of "Nozzle Rocket" but it sounds like a product developed for exactly this problem. But if you can see that the nozzles are caked, you might consider using distilled water to wet a paper towel and then stuff the thing in so it's in contact with the nozzle - the idea being to let the water soak into the caking for a bit to loosen it up.

This trick worked well for my old HP, though the mechanics of ink distribution are different in that system. Still, it's not going to hurt anything and might well be worthwhile - possibly as a pre-treatment for more Nozzle Rocket action.

I clean clogged nozzles, on my C86's by injecting a cleaning solution into the printhead from the screen /cartridge side. The solution is 85% DI / RO water, 3 % surfactant (Air Products, Surfynol 465), 4% DEG (di-ethylene glycol), 1% TEA (tri-ethylamine or use ammonia, but it can be hazardous if not well ventilated), 3 % IPA (isopropyl alcohol), 1% EDTA ( ethylene diamine tetra acidic acid, mono sodium salt), 2 % methyl pyrroldone, and 1 % algecide.

I place paper towels under the printhead and using a syringe with a 1/2 inch long piece of rubber or tygon tubing, small diameter and place it over the filter needle porting of the carrige. Vert slowly, low pressure) inject 2-3 ml of cleaning solution ( in your case the magenta inlet) and let set for several minutes. Y do not want high pressure to damage the nozzle plate to the piezo section of the prinhead. Next slowly apply addion solution and chexk to see if the magenta pigment is exiting the nozzle plate, if not wait a little longer. When the surfactants and cleaning agent do their job, the pigment will break free and flow thru the nozzles. Wer can not disperse them like Epson does, all we can do is get the dries pigment free from the surfaces it is sticking/plugging. After cleaning the check that the cartridge has ink flowing thru the exit port and that the vent is open and operating. If so replace ( exposure is that there maybe an air bubble that will take several cleaning cycles to clear. This process work 90 % of the time.

Alchemist

This thread makes me wonder a bit how these C86 printers are actually used and why anyone expects much from them, or for that matter that they are worth a lot of effort.

The reason is I had a C86 until just the other day. The black ink quit printing entirely, so I trashed the printer. I considered I had it for about 3 years and spent several times more on ink for it than the printer cost, plus it had a ream of paper go through it about every two months. So I think, and believe logically assumed, it was close to the end of its "duty cycle", it was worn out.

On the other hand many of the printer problems with ink clogging that are referred to me, after asking some questions, I find are used infrequently, and often left turned on without use for long periods. With inkjets that is a sure way to induce jet clogging.

After my C86 pooped, considering I used mine almost every day, it is a utility printer and not a photo printer BTW, I decided for just a bit more of a purchase price I could get a monochrome laser printer that is better suited to what I used the C86 to do most often, and get more pages for less "ink" cost.

As an individual I probably do a lot more volume of printing of all kinds than most of you because it is part of a full-time occupation (even though I call myself semi-retired). So the fact a C86 actually lasted as long in terms of how much was printed as mine did and without any problems, suggests for much less than $100, it was a good value, and I should not have expected more.

How this perspective my experience has afforded jibes with others use and experience might be interesting??????

David,

I think you hit the nail on the head. We tend to use printers, that are designed for light to medium duty, in a heavy duty role. The drying out of the pigmented inks, in particular, the early generation type used in the C86, tends to have been a issue with startup after extended periods of non-use. The newer pigmented K3 inks seem to have overcome most of these issues.
For heavy duty user expect to pay $600-$2000 for a photo high quality printer. Yes, I have gotten over 20,000 copies out of my Epson 1520 and 35,000 copies off a HP6122 but neither is a photo printer by today's standards. My Epson 3000 and 7600 are solid performers, but not cheep.
The three C86 I have left, out of 6 originally, were great buys for a pigmented ink printer and have lasted three years of extended photo testing of papers and inks. That is much more than I expected.

Alchemist

Alchemist,

One of the more interesting perspectives on printer economics is seen when you deduct the retail price of the ink that is included with a new printer purchase. If you go by Epson's on-line store the price of the new replacement of a C86, the C88 is $80, of that the retail price cost of the included inks is $60. So, the printer by itself is worth only $20.

So, it makes logical sense to me if a printer like an Epson C86 gives any trouble at all, just buy a new one when the inks are in need of replacement with the old printer, and the new printer then really costs you just $20.00!!!

An extreme example of this was that when I bought San Jose daughter a new computer this last Xmas, it was a Epson R200,
(which is a 6 color photo printer) for $49.95 on sale, which is less than a set of inks, shich came to nearly $80.

Dave,

With a printer at a sale price that does make the balance extreme, negative in fact.

The interesting thing is even with wide format pro printers the same economic ratio applies even though the cost of the printer is relatively high, the retail value of the inkset included is a large part of the total price, making the bare printer a pretty reasonable investment. The reason for that is the ink cartridges for large format printers hold a lot of ink and are therefore proportionally more expensive than consumer printer ink, but thankfully make a lot more prints too.

Quote:
Dave,

The interesting thing is even with wide format pro printers the same economic ratio applies even though the cost of the printer is relatively high, the retail value of the inkset included is a large part of the total price, making the bare printer a pretty reasonable investment. The reason for that is the ink cartridges for large format printers hold a lot of ink and are therefore proportionally more expensive than consumer printer ink, but thankfully make a lot more prints too.

Hmmmm... Let's look at the Epson Stylus Pro 7800 24" wide printer:
Printer plus ink cartridges: $2995
Eight 110ml ink cartridges: $560
Price of the bare printer: $2435
Is the bare printer a pretty reasonable investment in the context of this discussion? I don't think so!

Frans,

An exception does not prove the rule.

I just took delivery of a Canon ImageProGraph iPF 5000. Adorama's listed price is $1895. The amount of ink supplied with the printer is valued at $623.

Close to that is Epson's 4800 with an Epson list of $1995 (low price on Pricegrabber.com $1566) and the inkset supplied is the same as you quoted $560.

In both instances the inkset supplied with the printer is 1/3 the value of the total package.

So you found somewhat of an exception, and a printer a bit larger than most individual photographers are likely to purchase.

Your trying too hard and are a bit too obvious to be convincing.

David,

The examples given before you made your remarks about wide format pro printers indicated a printer price of 25% or less of the total price for the printer + inks. Then you claimed that for wide format pro printers the same economic ratio applies. Mine and your examples for wide format pro printers indicate a printer price of about 70 to 80% of the total price for printers + inks. So I think that my inputs are very valid.

So who is trying too hard here? It is you, my friend.

Frans,

Your point is not valid as I also said in the same sentence "the retail value of the inkset included is a large part of the total price" and the sentence as a whole does not imply it is as large a portion as it is with the C88, only that there is a ratio, and a factor in the cost of purchasing a printer not everyone may think of.

Again I assert that you are very obviously looking for things to criticize for obviously personal reasons. If that is the impression you want to create, that's your problem. But it serves no one participating in the forum any positive value, and I am sure most see you are being as obvious as I do.

David,

"...even with wide format pro printers the same economic ratio applies..."
The discussion up to that point was about how you could buy low cost printers for next to nothing/a small percentage of the total package price or even for free or at a negative cost. Then you throw in the remark about wide format pro printers having the same economic ratio. I just pointed out the errors in your comments, like it or not.